Warning: Transaction charge

[pugs]

Gary, thank you very much for your response, you have shone a light at the end of the tunnel.

1)
I have one BA open with all of today’s racing in tabs on a 2 second refresh. The 2 second refresh is important for me to know when a non runner has been removed, but even if this was 30 seconds, would all of the markets in tabs refresh simultaneously? Pushing me way over the 20 requests per second?
No, the throttling will not allow this, they will wait their turn. On 30 second refresh you would not see any difference, 30 seconds is enough time to refresh 300 markets (think of it as 10 markets per second)

Thank you. So BA could handle 40 markets in tabs on a 30 second refresh with Excel also placing/amending bets (sparingly) and never have to “back-up” data requests for more than 4 seconds (worst scenario) excellent. Just one thing, the highlighted tabs have been a timesaving godsend, and having the markets in tabs on a 2 second refresh will catch any “suspend” for a non runner removal whereas a 30 second refresh most likely won’t. Is it possible (in the future) to have the tab highlight (until clicked on) a non runner in the market?



2)
I have a second BA open with all racing markets in quick pick which i use for general betting, greening up, in-running, and to navigate to other Betfair markets i’m interested in. This BA is on a 0.5 second refresh. Would a counter work with 2 BA’s open?
No, it only works with one application, couldn't you just open another tab for this?

I have my second BA running on another pc. Pc 1 is tied up running all racing markets in Excel spreadsheets and all racing markets in BA tabs, so i am fairly hammering my resources on that pc, so having BA running at high speed in another tab is a bit like towing a caravan with a Ferrari on pc1. Is it possible that “data request throttle” could be set by user? ie both could be set to 10 per second? If this is possible then Gruss users could also have the option to have a BA/Excel open, and a BA open. (if that’s how it works, i’m not sure)


I also still use native interface to manage bets, how would you keep track of this usage?
This will not be be tracked, the new bets manager for BA is nearly complete, you shouldn't need the website.

That’s excellent news Gary. I know the bets manager has been a mammoth task. Imo Betfair has all but destroyed their web site and having a more familiar bets manager, in addition to what already is an excellent program will hopefully bring you many new (disgruntled) web interface users.

[Dai_Young]

Thanks for the responses Gary, I think I understand how these charges will work now.

Seems to me that betfair have specifically chosen 20 requests per second to prevent 100ms refreshers from monitoring more than one market. You are going to need to pay an awful lot of commission to offset the costs of monitoring multiple markets with a 0.1 second refresh for any significant length of time.

[PeteB]

It would help if they did something to reduce the need to monitor so frequently. For example, they could introduce a new feed of "time & sales" data - i.e. what trading activity has actually happened - at the moment it's just about possible to infer this as long as you have a fast refresh rate and make a few assumptions and guesses, but this charge will quickly put paid to that.

They're clearly trying to stamp down on screen-scraping. Maybe they've also noticed a correlation between people with high refreshes and people who pay little commission!

(Of course it would also help if they got their house in order and could do an upgrade without shagging everything up!)

Gary - have you done any testing on the new GetCompleteMarketPricesCompressed yet? I haven't had a chance to yet... Just wondering whether the data outside the best prices is still delayed - the documentation doesn't make this clear...

[methodman]

I bet mostly in running so need a fast refresh so have my refresh rate set at 0.1. However I do not need that speed until the market is in play so would an option to have a slow refresh until the market goes in play be a possibility?
I'm still a bit confused about how the new charges are likely to effect me.

[GaryRussell]

Gary, thank you very much for your response, you have shone a light at the end of the tunnel.

1)
I have one BA open with all of today’s racing in tabs on a 2 second refresh. The 2 second refresh is important for me to know when a non runner has been removed, but even if this was 30 seconds, would all of the markets in tabs refresh simultaneously? Pushing me way over the 20 requests per second?
No, the throttling will not allow this, they will wait their turn. On 30 second refresh you would not see any difference, 30 seconds is enough time to refresh 300 markets (think of it as 10 markets per second)

Thank you. So BA could handle 40 markets in tabs on a 30 second refresh with Excel also placing/amending bets (sparingly) and never have to “back-up” data requests for more than 4 seconds (worst scenario) excellent. Just one thing, the highlighted tabs have been a timesaving godsend, and having the markets in tabs on a 2 second refresh will catch any “suspend” for a non runner removal whereas a 30 second refresh most likely won’t. Is it possible (in the future) to have the tab highlight (until clicked on) a non runner in the market?



2)
I have a second BA open with all racing markets in quick pick which i use for general betting, greening up, in-running, and to navigate to other Betfair markets i’m interested in. This BA is on a 0.5 second refresh. Would a counter work with 2 BA’s open?
No, it only works with one application, couldn't you just open another tab for this?

I have my second BA running on another pc. Pc 1 is tied up running all racing markets in Excel spreadsheets and all racing markets in BA tabs, so i am fairly hammering my resources on that pc, so having BA running at high speed in another tab is a bit like towing a caravan with a Ferrari on pc1. Is it possible that “data request throttle” could be set by user? ie both could be set to 10 per second? If this is possible then Gruss users could also have the option to have a BA/Excel open, and a BA open. (if that’s how it works, i’m not sure)


I also still use native interface to manage bets, how would you keep track of this usage?
This will not be be tracked, the new bets manager for BA is nearly complete, you shouldn't need the website.

That’s excellent news Gary. I know the bets manager has been a mammoth task. Imo Betfair has all but destroyed their web site and having a more familiar bets manager, in addition to what already is an excellent program will hopefully bring you many new (disgruntled) web interface users.

1) I'll see what I can about highlighting the tab when there are non runners.

2) Sounds ok in theory, Ill have to test this though. I'll get back to you.

[GaryRussell]

It would help if they did something to reduce the need to monitor so frequently. For example, they could introduce a new feed of "time & sales" data - i.e. what trading activity has actually happened - at the moment it's just about possible to infer this as long as you have a fast refresh rate and make a few assumptions and guesses, but this charge will quickly put paid to that.

They're clearly trying to stamp down on screen-scraping. Maybe they've also noticed a correlation between people with high refreshes and people who pay little commission!

(Of course it would also help if they got their house in order and could do an upgrade without shagging everything up!)

Gary - have you done any testing on the new GetCompleteMarketPricesCompressed yet? I haven't had a chance to yet... Just wondering whether the data outside the best prices is still delayed - the documentation doesn't make this clear...

Sorry, not had chance to test this new call yet. I'll post here when I have.

[GaryRussell]

I bet mostly in running so need a fast refresh so have my refresh rate set at 0.1. However I do not need that speed until the market is in play so would an option to have a slow refresh until the market goes in play be a possibility?
I'm still a bit confused about how the new charges are likely to effect me.

It's certainly possible to add variable refresh rates, I'll add it to the list of suggestions. If you bet in running on the standard interface and only view one market at a time with no other tabs open then it wont affect you at all.

[methodman]

I have two tabs per meeting - both win and place. I have different tabs for each meeting because they dont always run to time.

[methodman]

You can then double all of that as I have a second licence for my test a/c

[GaryRussell]

I have two tabs per meeting - both win and place. I have different tabs for each meeting because they dont always run to time.

Is there any need for the tabs you are not viewing to refresh (eg. monitored for triggered betting). I can provide the option to stop the non visible tabs from refreshing.

[methodman]

its controlled by some simple spreadsheets so I just leave it running all day

[GaryRussell]

its controlled by some simple spreadsheets so I just leave it running all day

If you leave the the 'throttled' option on then you will be able to use the settings you have now without being concerned about exceeding the limit. The markets will be refreshed as quickly as 20 requests per second allow. This only applies to one instance of BA running, each instance of BA will not be aware of each other so if you are running two instances then each will have to be throttled to 10 requests. BA will also not be aware of any requests you make through the website so it's best if you can do everything through BA.

[methodman]

Thanks Gary - sounds OK I think my main account will be covered by the commission i pay anyway. The test a/c is another matter and as long as it can be controlled I think the biggest issue is going to be monitoring it and i think you have already addressed that.

[Captain Sensible]

methodman they'll treat your test ac and main as one account if they can match them both back to you.

"Multiple accounts relating to one person will also be treated as one entity for the purposes of calculating any potential charge"

[PeteB]

It also feels like they've got the weightings wrong - can see them not wanting you to call GetMarketPrices often (and they throttle this more on the Free API) but they should let you call GetMarketPricesCompressed often... Oh well...